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Sol-Ark compared to SMA

  • 1.  Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-02-2021 07:52 AM
    I am building a solar powered net zero house and I would like advice on inverters and system management.  Does anyone have thoughts or advice on Sol-Ark vs SMA?  

    Thanks

    Albert Bell

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    Albert Bell
    Professor
    University of Michigan
    Birmingham MI
    ahbelliv@umich.eduahbelliv@umich.edu
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  • 2.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 08-03-2021 09:28 AM

    I assume that you will be installing a battery backed system to store daytime energy for evening use? I don't know anything about SolArk inverters. But I have SMA battery backed system and Solar Edge Energy Hub system installed in my lab. Both have a 10 kWh LG battery.  We have only have them each for few months so can't say alot about performance. The SMA is AC coupled meaning you have 2 inverters, one is PV inverter (sunny boy or SB model) and other is battery charging (sunny boy storage or SBS model). It requires an advanced battery unit (ABU) transfer switch and grid interaction unit. My installer says the SMA SB inverters are great but the ABU and SBS are not so reliable. The customer interface for SB called Sunny Explorer or Sunny Portal are great, providing detailed control of operating parameters and feedback. You will need them to control the battery charging characteristic. SMA customer service is helpful and responsive.
    The Solar Edge Energy Hub is DC coupled so only one small inverter/charger. It also integrates the outdoor sensors (sunlight, temperature) and the EV charger. Designed to be used with module power optimizers Also has a very helpful and intuitive customer interface portal. It is designed as to be a residential microgrid. I have not had enough experience to evaluate the performance over time.

    Steve



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    Steven Hegedus
    Professor and Senior Scientist
    University of Delaware
    Newark Delaware
    ssh@udel.edu
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    Original Message


  • 3.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 08-03-2021 10:17 AM
    Make sure your main PV inverter is D.E.R. compatible. Allot of power companies are starting to require for pilot programs or as business as usual, the behind the meter communication AND control. Not a direction I like but be sure to check out those requirements.
    I would go long term lead acid (15-20 yrs), for a battery bank if you are going with a backup power function. Way cheaper then any Li solution. Unless you live in an area where TOU or demand charging is active and the rate differences are HUGE, just use your "bank" for power outages because you will never recover the increased degradation with rate savings.
    Other than that, there are a hundred different ways to skin the PV cat....

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    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
    fcfcfc@ptd.net
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    Original Message


  • 4.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-03-2021 10:30 AM

    I would talk to Scott Hunt at Practical Preppers. He has a lot of experience with Sol Ark and from what I have seen they made some nice technical advancements over the last few years. I currently have a grid tied PV array that uses micro inverters but I think I would probably seriously consider using Sol Ark if I were just starting out with a PV system.

    Robert Mellon 



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    Robert Mellon
    nmellon@verizon.net
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    Original Message


  • 5.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-03-2021 10:59 AM
    I have installed both.  Sol-Ark is what I prefer if we are adding batteries and their support is the best in the industry.  But SMA is typically much cheaper so we use them where we can use a string inverter without batteries.

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    David Hrivnak
    Sales/Engineering
    EcoLogical (part time)
    dhrivnak@chartertn.net
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    Original Message


  • 6.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Chapter Leader
    Posted 08-03-2021 11:18 AM
    suggest enphase micro inverters which come with free induvidual panel monitoring and house consumption at 15 m intervals

    ive had a 10 kw sys 10 years and a twelve kw five years   monitoring has been very helpful

    oversize sys 3 kw for each elec car

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    Drew Gillett
    p.e.
    Solar Engineers
    deaneg@hotmail.com
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    Original Message


  • 7.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Chapter Leader
    Posted 08-03-2021 01:01 PM
    replying to my own note  enphase makes the 10kwh stackable encharge storage ststem which altho not cheapest or easiest to integrate does work nicely with their inverters and monitoring

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    Drew Gillett
    p.e.
    Solar Engineers
    deaneg@hotmail.com
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    Original Message


  • 8.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 08-03-2021 01:14 PM
    The TL series SMA inverter at my zero net energy home has worked well for many years.  This was the only grid tied inverter available at that time, which would provide electricity on a sunny day when there is a grid failure, without connected batteries.



    Original Message


  • 9.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 08-03-2021 01:45 PM
    Edited by william fitch 08-03-2021 01:46 PM
    Isn't that the SMA line model that provide 120VAC on a "side" circuit, 1.5KW or so. But no "main" 240VAC..??.. when  the grid is down....

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    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
    fcfcfc@ptd.net
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 10.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-03-2021 02:14 PM
    Yes SMA has what is known as Secure Power and while nice has limitations.  It is basically limited to 2000 watts (1500 watts on older models), it only works when the sun is shining and you have to flip a switch to activate the one secure power outlet.  It is 120V only.  If you can get by with a simple string inverter I do like and install SMA.  But if you need rapid shutdown then we typically go with SolarEdge and if you want a battery then we have done Generac and Sol-Ark/Fortress power with Sol-Ark and Fortress being easier to work with.

    ------------------------------
    David Hrivnak
    Sales/Engineering
    EcoLogical (part time)
    dhrivnak@chartertn.net
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    Original Message


  • 11.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 08-03-2021 05:41 PM
    Yes, allot of choices. I am currently planning to bring an older array, approx 9KW and an SMA sb-8000-us back on line as a new array, but PPL is doing a DER pilot project with company supplied DER devices, and is requiring any new array inverters to have that communication capability, complete with an excepted inverter list. Needless to say, that inverter is not on the list, so I am looking into all the details of the PUC's settlement with them looking for a work around so perfectly good legacy equipment does not have to remain sitting on the floor inactive, along with me having to spend 3000 un-necessary dollars for a component I already have.

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    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
    fcfcfc@ptd.net
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 12.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Chapter Leader
    Posted 08-03-2021 07:47 PM
    this is yet another comm and control issue by utilities   they dont require this for night operated tables saws ( which have same liad profile)so why solar

    if they control the inverter ie clipping or reduction of output they should pay owner




    Original Message


  • 13.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 08-03-2021 05:58 PM
       Yes, only 120 VAC, and limited power.  This is clearly not a whole house battery backup system.  It costs about the same as other grid tied inverters, and provides enough power to run a refrigerator, other small appliances, or charge batteries; while the sun is bright.  This inverter is good for people who do not want to pay for large batteries or a generator. 
      



    Original Message


  • 14.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-11-2021 08:31 PM
    Both systems work with Zero Export, Each one has their own prices. 

    SolArk has their zero export option but i think it is not yet certified, you will need to contact them. SMA as well has their zero export  option. 

    Now comes the tricky part.
    SolArk everything is included in one inverter
    It Works with several low voltage battery brands, but since it is low voltage it will require large conductors.
    Everything needed for monitoring is included with the Inverter.

    SMA
    Need to get the Sunny Boy for Solar part and another inverter the Sunny Storage for the Battery. 
    It works with several high voltage battery brands, I advise not to use any LG battery with them (white paper from SMA)
    Need to get a monitoring system That communicates through RS485. I think the Wattnodes works well. You also need to get the CTs. 

    You will spend more using SMA, but it is a reliable system. SolArk has grown in the Market and so far i just installed one without any post sales headaches.

    Both systems will require following their guidelines to avoid exceeding their PV to battery Ratios. 





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    Baker Makarem
    baker.makarem@gmail.com
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    Original Message


  • 15.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 08-12-2021 09:56 AM
    If you want backup power I think you should consider Outback Power's Skybox.  It integrates an inverter and a charge controller and can be set up for non-export. Limited to 5kw throughput but can be "stacked" with a second (or more) Skybox to add capacity.

    https://www.outbackpower.com/downloads/documents/flyers/outback_092019_skybox_bifold_pageview.pdf

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    Mike Curran
    Retired from (dare I say it?) Fossil Plant Mgt.
    joacchim57@gmail.com
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    Original Message


  • 16.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-12-2021 11:25 AM
    I have been using a SOlArk 8K since May 2019.  It replaced a Fronius which was installed to work with 8 solar panels (installed in 2007).  At that time I noticed a about a 10% increase of power sent into the house panel - as measured by the smart meter & reported on my power bill.  In September 2019 I replaced the 8 panels with 21 325W panels.  In January 2020 I installed 30 LiFePo4 batteries (2P15S) as well as a transfer switch.  I dedicated 7 of the house circuits to the SolArk + solar array + battery bank system.  As a result, during the few instances of grid power outages, these circuits kept providing power while the rest of the house went dark.

    Last year, 2020, the Solar+battery+Solark system generated power equivalent to 50% of the power I purchased from the power company.  This year the system may do better because we set our house thermostat at 78F, 24/7 while we have been away for July and half of August, whereas last year we stayed home.

    At the time I purchase the SolArk 8K, it seemed to be the simplest solution to having a hybrid solar/battery + grid tied system.  Thus far it appears to have been a good decision.

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    Julius Hayden
    jjhaydeniii@earthlink.net
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    Original Message


  • 17.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-18-2021 11:41 AM
    Hi,

    I want to thank everyone.  I have been off the grid for a couple of weeks.  All the input is very helpful.  As an update, our future home has been pre-certified by PHIUS Home Page.  This is the first home pre-certified to the new 2021 standards.  The system will have batteries to manage energy during the diurnal cycle as well as emergency back-up.  Currently, I am thinking about using Sol-Ark and  Simpliphi Power Home Page  batteries.

    ------------------------------
    Albert Bell
    Professor
    University of Michigan
    Birmingham MI
    ahbelliv@umich.eduahbelliv@umich.edu
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 18.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 08-18-2021 01:26 PM
    Good battery choice.  I have been using 3 of them (225Ah) in a grid-tied, battery backup application for 2 years now.  No complaints.

    ------------------------------
    Mike Curran
    Retired from (dare I say it?) Fossil Plant Mgt.
    joacchim57@gmail.com
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 19.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 08-18-2021 04:17 PM
    Just to be 100% clear, the NEW home is on grid or off grid capable or off grid?

    ------------------------------
    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
    fcfcfc@ptd.net
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 20.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-19-2021 12:26 PM
    Hi

    The new home will be tied to the grid.  I hope to manage the electrical use during the high solar radiation months over the entire diurnal cycle from solar with the batteries. During low solar radiation months the grid would supplement.  The home is entirely electrical and will be heated and cooled with three mini-split heat pumps.  I am still working out the details.  Thanks for the questions and advice

    ------------------------------
    Albert Bell
    Professor
    University of Michigan
    Birmingham MI
    ahbelliv@umich.eduahbelliv@umich.edu
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 21.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-20-2021 10:19 AM
      |   view attached
    You are in a good position to maximize the building envelope's efficiency and thus be able to reduce your electric consumption, which will allow you to to install a smaller array.  Pipe insulation and superinsulating the building envelope will never never cost less, nor give you a bigger bang for your buck.  Good luck.  I'm not quite net zero energy here in Maine, with only a single mini split dx cold climate HP system and 4+kW of solar, but my house is 3000 sf.  My hot water is old school flat plate solar hot water, but with the heat pump water heaters available I'd happily increase my solar array and get rid of the solar hot water panels and its related mechanical and plumbing issues.  (I will probably do that within the next few years.) I still love my 40 year old attached greenhouse with its thermal mass, and the side benefits of being a green space, heat source and kitchen garden.  My total energy expense is about $800/yr being grid tied, with Maine's net energy billing policy.  I do burn a little (1 cord +/-) of wood, which is factored into that energy expense.   I had 4 children, which was my need for the larger home, but I'm in the process of creating an in-law apartment with the extra space for future retirement income.




    Original Message


  • 22.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-23-2021 11:52 AM
    Not sure where to ask this question.

    I am interested in anyone who has residential solar in the San Antonio, TX area. Also locations with carport roof solar? thanks
    Harlan



    Original Message


  • 23.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-24-2021 10:32 AM
    I recommend you start with our sister TXSES chapter in San Antonio:

    Solar San Antonio merged with Build San Antonio Green, a nationally recognized award-winning green building program. They host Bring Solar Home,  designed to help San Antonians discover if solar generation is the right choice, and if so which program is the best fit. As a voluntary, third-party certification program, BSAG also works with the residential building community to help create homes with increased efficiency, comfort, and durability. Programs include single-family new construction, historic retrofits, and multi-family projects.

    They should be able to point you towards solar carport installers in the San Antonio area.

    Michael Fladmark
    NTREG Board Member
    Dallas chapter of TXSES which is the state chapter of ASES

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    Michael Fladmark
    Principal
    MJFladmark, LLC
    Tool TX
    mfladmark@mindspring.com
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    Original Message


  • 24.  RE: Sol-Ark compared to SMA

    Posted 08-24-2021 11:22 AM
    Great. Thank you for your reply




    Original Message