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DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

  • 1.  DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 01-05-2023 12:05 PM
    Edited by william fitch 01-06-2023 05:52 AM
    EA DC Fast Charge 350KW Station.
    This is another article I recently wrote regarding EV, which I regard as heavily linked to solar energy. In short, I consider them twins, just from different households.
    Here is the link:
    https://fcfcfcwearesolar.blogspot.com/2023/01/dc-fast-charge-conundrum.html

    Happy new year....

    As an addendum, the relationship between EV and solar is not superficial. A very heavy percentage of people who have solar have EV, and a very heavy percentage of people who have EV get solar. One is Steak, the other is A1 sauce (Just not sure which one is which). By promoting EV and by promoting solar, we can loop in the benefits of one while simultaneously promoting the other, and the exact opposite dynamic. Surveys commonly point to about a 60% overlap between the two. I think there may be some credence in the idea that if you can use driving which Americans LOVE as a Psychological association to Solar (associative conditioning) while simultaneously de-coupling EV from its negative BS political splatter in favor of cheaper miles, solar could get a free ride on EV's advancement. 
    Just some thoughts......
     



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    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
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  • 2.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 01-06-2023 11:32 AM
    Great article, William! Thanks so much. I agree it's important to ensure that advocacy and awareness around solar also discuss EVs. I didn't know that commonly around 60% of people who have solar also have EVs; thank you for sharing!

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    Ella Nielsen
    Membership & Engagement Manager
    American Solar Energy Society
    Boulder CO
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  • 3.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 01-06-2023 12:57 PM
    Hi: Yes. It is a pretty strong relationship as relationships go. Its talked about but I think it is very overlooked as a potentially huge opportunity to leap-frog both upwards. In a way it reminds me of the completely missed chances during the gas price spikes of the past 2 years in "pounding" ICE with commercials of people in EV's driving by the lines, smiling while others complain, the commercial opportunity for comparison could keep an TV ad agency going 24/365. It kind of makes one wonder why such low hanging fruit was so blatantly overlooked. 
    Anyway the phrase, "Cheap miles" could be the tag line for a whole host of commercials and ads linking and promoting the two together. 
    But again, just some ideas. I am contemplating who should play the Father, Mother and young daughter in the driveway scene.

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    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
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  • 4.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 01-06-2023 12:54 PM
    I agree with you William. EV + Solar + Vehicle-2-Grid are triplets!

    One argument the naysayers use is "When you charge your EV, you are burning coal". That's where solar and day charging your EV crush that argument. And with V2G, we could achieve distributed grid storage with cars, trucks and buses when they are parked and connected two ways to the grid.

    Consider for example, that the lowest cost Telsa Model 3 has 57.5 kWH of storage - or more than 2 Tesla Powerwall 2's (5 KW continuous, 13kWH capacity each). Meaning, you could power your home from your car when required (after they add that capability).


    Andrew Stone, President
    NM People's Energy Cooperative
    Community Owned Community Solar
    ¡Sí, hablo Español!










  • 5.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 01-06-2023 01:23 PM
    If this string gets any longer, someone has to start practicing birth control. 

    Generally speaking, the best way (Psychologically) to crush BS or what I like to refer to as "baggage" is not to try an attack directly the BS and "take it away from them". But to re-direct the agenda to something different (Cheaper miles) and get them of their own "mind" to simply drop "the load.", the BS. They already know actually it is BS in the first place. They don't cling to it because its true, but for other reasons. This produces a far more potent and lasting change of thinking. You can accomplish this though it requires cleverness and calculation. 

    I managed to get myself on a V2X companies pre product release evaluation "group" regarding V2X of course. I have a personal interest in acquiring a unit when available assuming it can meet my local power requirements. I am sorry I can not be more specific, but I had to sign an NDA, etc.. Seems like it will be fun...

    But I agree, that "triad" is potentially the ticket to a solid distributed energy dynamic.

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    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
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  • 6.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 01-07-2023 04:17 PM
    William has given me the ideal lead-in to resurrect this video of a talk I first gave at Solar 2013.  I was asked to repeat it at Solar 2014, where some friends convinced Dave and Paulette to film it.

    Though slightly dated, I think it has stood the test of time, with one exception:  Ignore the numbers on the Energy Intensity vs. Fuel Mileage graph.  The Transportation Energy Data Book used a flawed methodology back then.  The point I made with that slide is still valid; it just requires a longer, more nuanced explanation now that DOE has fixed their error.

    Dave Erb
    Asheville, NC





  • 7.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 01-07-2023 05:35 PM
    Edited by william fitch 01-07-2023 09:03 PM
    I am trying to re-write my comment because I just accidently wiped it out. They need an "UNDO" on this blog interface. 

    I watched the vid skipping through it. For me it is pretty much see spot run. I say that with no negative aspect. It is just I have been in tech and RE so long I have pretty much seen it all. I am assuming the "religious" angle is for presentation and flare purposes. Nice touch. It if it is anything other than that, I don't want to know anyway. 

    Range anxiety is a real and justified "thing" in some cases. It pretty much is a case by case analysis. DC fast charge can solve this issue, but the business case (Capitalism) is not very good as I expressed in my article. That of course is why the FFI and all its slaves want any type of GOV aggressive implementation of DC nationwide fast charge to die.
    I mean frankly, if you want to know what actions to get done, just look at what they fight. Its really that simple.

    I wrote a TFTD a long time ago, #037 which makes it over 20 years old:
    #037.     "Mankind will not go, " the way of the dinosaur", for lack of "the saving" technologies, but for the inability to make money on it, i.e., Capitalism does not bring the best goods and services to market but the ones that make the most money."

    The "sin" you refer to in your sermon is in fact $$. Again that simple. 
    Someone once said that if you eliminate all that is possible as an explanation, you are left with the impossible. 
    In this specific case I would label the "impossible" as that causal agent that we refuse to look at as the culprit. $$.
    And as a matter of Physics and Engineering which I am sure you can appreciate, if one refuses to look at and alter that specific causal agent for the problem, the possible implementation of a solution is left to accident. Not very good odds or prognosis.
    Again though, liked the vid and infused humor. Strictly from the audio, it seemed like the attending crowd was small, but enthusiastic.
    Often times, especially in the past, that was the only realty.

    What I find more troubling and skewed from this exact conversation, in fact supports this thought, "If you can't survive the short term, the long term will not be your problem." It is my estimation that "the people" do not realize the absolutely horrific situation we are in in terms of our current socio-political realities. Massive social events of history happened not because there weren't any people to see the train coming, but that, seeing the train coming is no where near a guarantee that you can avoid it. If that were not true, we would not have horrific events made by man in our past.

    All these things we talk about here are under the auspices of an umbrella of freedom and function. The production of Fascism is not one of betterment, but only of the effort to feed the war machine for power and control. Neither of those, aside from any attempt at ethics or morality, would address the global warming issue. In fact it would accelerate it.

    I am going to watch "Wednesday Adams" for an emotional uplift.


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    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
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  • 8.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    Posted 01-09-2023 10:19 AM
    The Aptera has 1000 mile range and built in solar. No need to ever use DCFC, just drive all day and plug into a Level 1 or 2 at your hotel or campground. Even the 600 mile version is probably as much as the average person drives in a day on road trips. 

    DCFC can use an incredible amount of energy, especially if there are multiple stations all being used. The problem with this is that solar canopies won't power it all, unlike level 2 chargers. People are working on high efficiency inductive charging built into freeways (with solar on the road side powering it) but who knows if that will work.

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    Julia Moravcsik
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  • 9.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 01-09-2023 11:54 AM
    Hi Julia: Its funny you would mention them. I get their "news" alerts. I have always found their car concept very forward and appealing. I lean towards the streamlined in design, as opposed to the shoe box on 4 wheels. Now granted, you can't throw the family in and do a packed vacation drive to Disney for 4, but it is a niche. But you bring out again a major point I detail in my article. As technology continues, unlike the Gasoline world, the need for non-home charging will in all likelihood be reduced as time moves forward and the energy density of batteries increase, and alternative charging methods are found (Induction, direct solar, etc..) EV as a transportation methodology is incredibly disruptive and volatile, which is one of the reasons it is being fought so hard by the entrenched. Induction charging is being put into roadways expanding from the pure test phase to probably what I would call more real world Alpha-Beta testing. I see that fitting very well with the whole Autonomous push, not that I am a fan.
    BTW, the season finale of, "Wednesday" was really good. I didn't think they were going to be able to cram all that in in one "install". Now its hurry up and wait for S2.​​

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    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
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  • 10.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    Posted 01-09-2023 01:46 PM
    Autonomous vehicles will be great for climate change. People won't own cars anymore, so less embodied carbon, as fewer cars can service more people. Robotaxis will be right-sized. Most drives are for one person, and instead of using a 2 ton EV, you can use a tiny pod. Less car accidents and injuries/deaths. Parking lots will be torn down, making cities greener and more compact. People will convert their garages into storage or another room, and new houses won't have garages. Low income people can travel quicker in more direct paths, instead of long, circuitous public transportation.

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    Julia Moravcsik
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  • 11.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 01-09-2023 02:31 PM
    Hi Again: LOL... no enthusiasm there...
    Well, before we bring out the pavement strippers and wrecking balls, let's first take out the Gorilla in the room and see what is left after that. 

    I will leave you a thought. There is a reason why the ultra rich want their own copters and jet planes. 
    Watch any good Hollywood Dystopian film and who do you see leaving "Dodge" while all the cattle die below because they are stranded. I mean hell, look at what Chris Christy was able to do with just one bridge. (Sorry, couldn't resist)
    Having your own personal transportation goes to resiliency when times get tough. Public and shared systems are the first ones to fail or be shut down under such circumstances.

    Also, I think it is physically fair that you will see a further schism develop between Urban and Rural based not only on Ideological differences but travel distances as well.

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    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
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  • 12.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 01-10-2023 02:14 PM
    Thank you Julia for mentioning the Aptera, which has some similarities to my 2001 Honda Insight.  The Honda Insight also weighs less than 2,000 pounds, and streamlines the airflow to lessen drag.  Last week my car became less efficient because the driver side rear wheel well cover fell off.  Not knowing exactly what part of the state highway to search, I walked both sides of about five miles, examining every snowbank and drainage ditch.  It vanished.  If anyone has a spare wheel well cover please contact me at Alpine Solar in Windsor, Massachusetts.

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    Stu Besnoff
    owner
    Alpine Solar Heat and Hot Water, LLC
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  • 13.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    Silver
    Contributor
    Posted 01-10-2023 04:59 PM
    On eBay there seems to be lots of Passenger side ones. Couldn't find one drivers side for your year, just 2010.
    I am guessing the dealer is no help..??..

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    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
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  • 14.  RE: DC Fast Charge Conundrum.

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 01-10-2023 08:09 PM
    About eight years ago the dealer had no access to a part that was needed.  It appears that they get more profit from parts for newer cars.  I never went back to the dealer.

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    Stu Besnoff
    owner
    Alpine Solar Heat and Hot Water, LLC
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