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Delicate yet important

  • 1.  Delicate yet important

    Posted 06-29-2022 09:13 AM
    Most of us are tuned into the hearings and also distressed over Supreme Court news. Now we hear about the case before them of West Virginia vs EPA. If successful the suit will cripple federal legislation addressing climate change.

    We're not a political association. I get that. But we're in this work for a reason and presently our work is being targeted by, as Noam Chomsky put as as far back as 2016, "the most dangerous organization in world history."

    I'll leave that to your imagination, to whom he is referring or "to what" he is referring. Perhaps we need to discuss strategy and tactics to meet these challenges somewhere else.

    But if anyone is interested in this conversation, I'm also interested in pragmatic approaches to engagement, as a block of like minded souls.

    Thank you

    --
    Captain Sol


  • 2.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 06-30-2022 09:22 AM
    Realistically the easiest way to move forward is probably raising our renewable energy standard in Missouri. It is due for an update anyway.

    Regards,
    Alan Dierker, CPA




  • 3.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 06-30-2022 09:38 AM
      |   view attached
    Thank you Alan and John. Yes Alan, I agree, but what I am suggesting is that we mobilize as an industry. As ASES members we only partly represent our voting block. As you know ASES members tend to be on the academic side, the tech side, the government side, etc. Our blue collar brothers and sisters who are climbing around on rooftops tend to work with solar sales organizations who mostly don't even know about ASES.

    We're facing a full on assault with Supreme Court case West Virginia vs EPA. But they won't stop there. Actually, beyond our industry, we should join hands with SUN (Solar United Neighbors--who represent homeowners and businesses that have solar panels) and all solar panel users in our fragile democracy.

    Many of us are working in this industry because we understand we have no choice but to seek pragmatic solutions to our energy problem, specifically an economy largely controlled by big oil, big pharma, banks and the power elite. One rooftop at a time, we are actually making change, not just wondering how.

    The Chairman of the Board of the US Solar Coalition and myself, realize we need to be cautious how we tread into this hornet's nest, but we are also realists and warriors and we're not afraid of a good fight.

    ------------------------------
    Winston RILEY
    Executive Director
    US Solar Coalition
    www.ussolarcoalition.org
    ------------------------------



  • 4.  RE: Delicate yet important

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 07-01-2022 09:49 AM
    When advocating for democratization of energy generation we need to emphasize creating generation partners over letting utilities control the what, when, where decisions to meet a renewable portfolio standard.

    ------------------------------
    Frank Kelly
    Little Rock AR
    frank@solarsourceconsulting.com
    ------------------------------



  • 5.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 07-01-2022 10:15 AM
    Thanks Frank. No question. One of the things USSC positions as a third pillar is working with ancillary services such as municipalities and utility companies. Like all of you, I'm sure, we've seen cooperation and we've seen outright hostility toward systems being permitted.

    Perhaps in the long haul, the system will be revamped, as we approach a sustainable mix of energy. We all know it is quite insane that given the circumstances where now solar is the cheapest, and clean and solves so many problems we face by a fucked up grid. But for now, we have to accept small steps and gradually find that employees of those ancillary services are potentially partners in our efforts. We, first, want to be able to teach them how to work on the project and how to get things done swiftly, without unnecessary delays (certainly without prejudice or unreasonable roadblocks). Then to certify them so they will have a form of continuing education that helps them find better paying work by organizations who will cherish their efforts.


    ------------------------------
    Winston Riley
    Executive Director
    US Solar Coalition
    www.ussolarcoalition.org
    CaptainSol@ussolarcoalition.org
    ------------------------------



  • 6.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 07-01-2022 11:29 AM
    I see these comments and believe that someone is misinterpreting the SCOTUS decision re: the EPA case.  The decision did not affect Federal legislation, rather it affected the overreach of the EPA's regulation authority.  The SCOTUS said that the regulations promulgated by the EPA should have been properly legislated rather than having an non elected branch of the Government making these type of rules.  And on another note, I have a difficult time listening to folks on this site constantly looking down on those who don't agree 100% with your views and denigrating those folks who don't have professional degrees when they don't agree with your positions.  That having been said, go ahead and flame away.

    ------------------------------
    John A Lichty
    jalichty@bresnan.net
    ------------------------------



  • 7.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 07-01-2022 11:59 AM
    "rather it affected the overreach..."
    Overreach. You just assumed your conclusion... and dumped your load...
    Which basically says that ANY regulatory agency, despite its very name, regulatory, should not be in the decision making business. Only voted in people should make decisions. Sounds like the thinking regarding the board of corporation. They are voted in. Of course the only people that get to vote there are those with a vested profit interest, IE stock holders. Sounds like you are more interested in promoting the FMC (Free Market Capitalist) thinking process on Government, as Scotus is now doing.
    Misinterpreting Scotus. How could you? Two if not three of them lied to congress regarding R.VS.WADE and did the exact opposite. SO yes maybe, it is very easy to misinterpret a liar. Well said.
    Profit over everything, literally.
    Flame away is it....

    ------------------------------
    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
    fcfcfc@ptd.net
    ------------------------------



  • 8.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 07-01-2022 12:57 PM
    Thank you everyone for your participation, making this lively. I just started a thread and I'm not the moderator and not trying to be. I'm sure there are rules we agree to follow here and, I for one want to be careful to follow them. Not that anyone has broken any rules but, for myself, I want to proclaim I wasn't "looking down" on anyone and never attempted to denigrate anyone.

    As to the scotus ruling, Mr. Lichty has every right to interpret the ruling as a sensible and valid act. I personally disagree and I've read it. If we don't try to regulate things like emissions and if we don't write legislation to limit the behavior of corporations which don't value people's health and ecosystems, the speed to which climate change causes hell and brimfire will be accelerated.

    Most of us (obviously not all) who work in solar, believe in the science of climate ch ange. Others have financial interests and have done well in the marketplace of solar with finance and other instruments and may believe that humankind is just a few thousand years old. But variety is the spice of life and debate is healthy. I will say, if we are to have a debate about this Supreme Court, we should acknowledge circumstances as William mentioned and that Thomas's wife Ginni is implicated in what is playing out at the Capitol.

    For myself though, I'm not here to debate but to find like minded folks to help me address issues within our industry so that we can be even more effective getting more solar installed. For sure, the scotus ruling isn't good news for the solar industry. Actually it is horrendous. Not looking down my nose at anyone but I'll suggest we are really traveling backwards.


    ------------------------------
    Winston Riley
    Executive Director
    US Solar Coalition
    www.ussolarcoalition.org
    CaptainSol@ussolarcoalition.org
    ------------------------------



  • 9.  RE: Delicate yet important

    ASES Life Member
    Posted 06-30-2022 12:04 PM
    ASES must be a lobbying organization for solar. Yes, ASES to survive must be 'political'. 
                                      dnb

    Dale N. Bickenbach 
    5232 South Mason Avenue Tacoma, Washington 
    98409-1817 
    +1 253 475 5242  Worldwide Cell 
    or 2-2223 Sapporo Drive Whistler, British Columbia V8E 0B5 
    SKYPE: dale.n.bickenbach
    WhatsApp





  • 10.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 06-30-2022 12:25 PM
    Edited by Winston RILEY 06-30-2022 12:27 PM
      |   view attached
    Thanks Dale. I'm a newbie. Just a member for a few years. But as I understand it, SEIA is more along the lines of advocacy. But there are others by far more educated on such issues as I. Still, what I have found, that none of them, not ASES, not SEIA, not SEI or any of the SEA's are doing quite what we think is missing.

    On the consumer side, I think SUN (Solar United Neighbors is working hard at the legislative table, but that is on behalf of solar panel owners).

    The reason Patrick and I have started USSC is to provide a trade association for the companies which are actually getting solar installed. We will focus on three pillars. Education K-12, continuing education for our members--on the correct way to position solar in the marketplace and get leads for member companies based on our straight forward educational approach and to educate and certify the employees of ancillary providers such as utility companies and municipalities, to help smooth out the last mile.

    There's plenty of room for all of us to work together and cross-over. The bottom line is getting more solar installed. To go from 3% to 30 or 50% in the timeframe we need to, will take every little boat in the water (like at Dunkirk).

    Cheers,

    ------------------------------
    Winston RILEY
    Executive Director
    US Solar Coalition
    www.ussolarcoalition.org
    ------------------------------



  • 11.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 06-30-2022 01:13 PM
    I'll likely be retiring from my active solar product design consulting efforts shortly and might want to become active in more advocacy efforts. Let me know if/where I can help.

    ------------------------------
    Caroll Marston
    Engineering Consultant
    MARSTON AND ASSOCIATES
    SOUTHPORT NC
    Marston.associates@gmail.com
    ------------------------------



  • 12.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 06-30-2022 01:34 PM
      |   view attached
    Mr. Marston. Thanks for your interest in helping. Your insight, not only as a solar professional and design (your invention for non-penetrating roof clamp and other engineering expertise), and your rubber business experience before that, reveals that you were a problem solver, probably since a child and on thru your engineering degree, and eventually now retiring from Marston and Associates.

    We need help. Advocacy won't be our main objective with USSC. But given the political climate we're in and heeding such warnings as Dr. Chomsky shared with us in Albuquerque at this year's conference, some of us feel that more pressing than even climate change right now, is addressing this newest threat. That being preventing rational discourse with (I shutter to say it)but with these Fascist strategies and tactics that are working in a very organized and well planned campaign.

    We represent a rather large block of voters, the solar industry (if we think bigger to include all organizations working on sustainable issues and energy) and as such we tend to be like minded. So our activism won't be to "get out the vote" among our members--we will already be voting the right way. But as activists, we can join with campaigns and other organizations to make sure we retain the House and take back the Senate in the midterms. If we don't do that, sadly, I feel I will most likely find another country to live in. History has shown that Fascist regimes aren't kind to its citizens.

    ------------------------------
    Winston Riley
    Executive Director
    US Solar Coalition
    www.ussolarcoalition.org
    CaptainSol@ussolarcoalition.org
    ------------------------------



  • 13.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 06-30-2022 03:36 PM
    I imagine building membership numbers to increae our "voiced" positions and opinions on things would be a reasonable approach to showing support in the affirmative or negative of a position.

    How do I get an electronic membership badge to show on LinkedIn? 


    Just a thought,
    -Alfredo





  • 14.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 07-01-2022 06:12 AM
    Excellent idea Alfredo. I'll work on it today. Critical as we wake up today is to notice that West Virginia vs EPA barely made the news, although Biden is taking the microphone to criticize the rogue SCOTUS. But the point you make is correct and we also need to join hands right now with other renewable energy partners and all "green apparatus," to mobilize and clearly inform anyone who will read and try to digest. If you haven't seen Dr. Chomsky's warning he issued to us during the ASES conference, please do so. Here's the link. Please skip ahead of my intro and listen to his every word.

    Noam Chomsky issues warning

    I'm in touch with Noam this morning and asking him to help with the urgent challenge. It seems to me, with SCOTUS totally compromised, if we don't retain the house and regain the Senate in November, I believe the doomsday clock second hand would at that point be one second to midnight. Meaning it is over. No retrieving hope to stop the well executed plan to destroy organized human life on the planet.

    ------------------------------
    Winston Riley
    Executive Director
    US Solar Coalition
    www.ussolarcoalition.org
    CaptainSol@ussolarcoalition.org
    ------------------------------



  • 15.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 07-04-2022 09:39 AM
    Winston,
    The needle was moved on CFC's through International Treaties i.e. the Montreal Protocol - it has taken half a lifetime, but we have a standard that has some teeth down to state licensing requirements for contractors.
    I see the same type of Protocols as a natural course of being in alignment with the UN Sustainable Development Goals through vehicles like the Paris Climate Agreement.
    If the membership doesn't want to be a PAC, maybe a volunteer contribution to one that we have values alignment with might be a way to get our voices heard.

    Just a thought.

    -Alfredo


    https://www.unep.org/ozonaction/who-we-are/about-montreal-protocol



    ------------------------------
    Alfredo Melendez
    alfredomelendezjr1977@gmail.com
    ------------------------------



  • 16.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 07-04-2022 03:12 PM
    Alfredo. I'm a fan of this kind of thinking.





  • 17.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 07-01-2022 08:37 AM
    Edited by william fitch 07-01-2022 08:56 AM
    Hi Winston: I feel like there should be at least 3 paragraphs of a disclaimer before I say my blunt response here. 
    I love all solar and RE in general. I built a parabolic thermal trough collector back in the 70's, just for starters. Currently I am just about net zero in home and transportation.
    That said referring to this part of you message:
    "We're not a political association. I get that. But we're in this work for a reason and presently our work is being targeted by, as Noam Chomsky put as as far back as 2016, "the most dangerous organization in world history."
    First off, "political" is nothing more than an assembly of "one's" world views with targeted agendas to maintain the status quo or change it. That's all. 
    The use of the word "presently", regarding the FFI's action towards the threat of RE to their cash flow. ARE YOU KIDDING ME!! They were the first ones to know that CO2 was going to be a problem back in the 60's. They have been executing their misinformation plan and its associated corruption since the beginning!! Making statements like that are as bad as, "recently in 2016 it was noticed by scientists that water gets you wet". 
    Regarding what you can do. You can play in the weeds all you want and effect small things around you. But there is a global agenda in play regarding our little blue planet with too many people, diminishing resources (Including FRESH water), the near term coming of, practically speaking, ending human labor via all available tech (So how are  the masses going to make a living?), the continued acceleration of CW, the world wide expansion of totalitarian control (by, by Democracy), the growing use of governmental militaries against their own people (USA militias and the militarization of the police (1033 act, etc.)), Global Warming (By, By, all), etc. I call it the five vectors. If you want a sixth, add Nuclear suicide (Nuclear Winter followed by a devastating Nuclear Summer).
    My advice. Narrow your focus away from broad change. Focus on engineering not "political speak".  The later you will fail as noted by (just one example) the latest SC EPA attack. 
    I will leave you with a couple of my TFTD (Thoughts for the day):

    292.    "The FFI (Fossil Fuel Industry) is using Global Warming as a Thanos finger snap."
    286.    "How many dead Billionaires does it take to screw in a Wealth Tax?"
    283.   "Ukrainians are our Hero's
                We will watch them die
                Behold our TV's will not cry
                Fossil Fuels are our Apple Pie."
    277.    "Conclusions based on a steady stream of distortions and lies will not result in truthful or productive paths benefiting society. Such a formula if allowed to exist for any period of time, will only result in a society bleeding poison, misery and pain. It is up to the rest of society to correct these capitalistically driven corruptions for their own survival, and morally everyone else's."
    093.     "The only ideals or realities the wealthy and powerful will bank roll, is their own wealth and power. No action will be taken unless that agenda is satisfied first."
    067.     "For a solution to be found for a problem, the system has to allow the solutions creation and implementation, otherwise the exercise is futile."

    ------------------------------
    william fitch
    Owner
    www.WeAreSolar.com
    fcfcfc@ptd.net
    ------------------------------



  • 18.  RE: Delicate yet important

    Posted 07-01-2022 09:59 AM
    Thank you William. Honestly I'm not sure if your reply is on the board or just came to me personally. I hope others were able to see your thought provoking reply. I sent you a personal email and hope you'll call.

    For the few of us who share these thoughts on this thread, it is (I guess) a form of entertainment. WHAT comes of it, is the nugget of gold (if anything constructive comes of it).

    Personally, I see no other pathway but voting, unfortunately. We know SCOTUS is compromised and all the chatter about how to fix that (stack the court, impeachment, outright proof of their lying under oath--whatever) won't happen with the current political will. We can't even outlaw assault rifles and magazines designed for war. We sure won't remove a lifetime appointed judge. That is until after the midterms IF we retain the house and take back the Senate.

    Unless someone else can show me the more "focused" approach that is pragmatic and doable, I believe Climate Change and Nuclear war or accident fall in AFTER the current dilemma, of rational discourse being eliminated in our country. We need to forcibly act and not take no for an answer. We can only do that if we control the three branches. Even then, if we don't immediately use that power to fix the SCOTUS, then that committee of assassins will over rule anything that can be challenged legally.

    ------------------------------
    Winston Riley
    Executive Director
    US Solar Coalition
    www.ussolarcoalition.org
    CaptainSol@ussolarcoalition.org
    ------------------------------